Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 2:26 pm Post subject: Re: Validity of Testimonials?!
lucifer2 wrote:
Very interesting discussion, I think, Mr GT, although your argument is not very, very clear to me. But OK, to the extent that I understand your main point I'll try to respond. (And I’ll do it calmly, respectfully and with due modesty).
Well, you see, my problem here is that I’m afraid testimonials are always biased, and, probably, heavily biased most of the time. This would seem quite obvious, given the fact that your 'subjects' (i.e. the consumers), have a vested and very personal interest in "testing" the (quality of the) products under scrutiny here. So have the manufacturers and, probably, even much more so, as their income as well as their reputation are both quite clearly at stake here.
In the case of consumers then, a social psychological phenomenon called "cognitive dissonance" immediately comes into play when they realize they’ll have to evaluate a product of special significance to themselves. So, usually, they’ll do everything they can to avoid or eliminate any doubt or uncertainty (i.e. “dissonance”) as much as possible. Consumers generally buy these products for psychologically highly significant reasons: some may be desperate because of dire personal health, financial, sexual or romantic concerns. They'll pay substantial amounts of money to find a (a hopefully easy and rapid) way out of their plight. They may even “make” every extra effort thinkable to let their radionic machines, energy rings or plates and mp3 recordings do a neat job for them, so to speak. At least, initially. The “investment effect” (i.e. the initial enthusiasm), related to the product’s personal significance at the time of procurement, may and does more or less strongly wear off after a shorter or longer while. This, of course, depends on the (nature of the) user’s personality: sheer greed, infantile gullibility or (a tendency towards) compulsive hoarding may, for example, strongly determine the subject’s decision to purchase an object or accept it wholeheartedly as a present. Absolutely nothing wrong with that, of course, but by now you’ll probably agree with me that (particularly spontaneously related) testimonials should not the least be considered objective information at all. There are too many psychologically significant factors involved hampering their (especially long-term) trustworthiness.
I am well aware of these factors as well, and know they skew the value of a testimonial (and review). In fact, all advertising might as well be put into this category too. But then what are we left with? It means, [if I understand you correctly], that there is no point in ever posting a review, or submitting a testimonial, or paying attention to any advertising. Either the vested interest in having your money be well-spent, and not looking foolish taints the review/testimonial, or everything ever bought was just coincidentally useful at the time.
It is my opinion that at a deeper level your arguments are based on fear and in particular a scarcity-based mindset. In an abundant universe, there is no lack of money, therefore it can never be "wasted" and one never worries about purchase. Of course it obviates the need for about 90% of the objects for sale, since an abundant universe eliminates fear as well.
So if we go a bit deeper, it is mostly fear and an abundance-lacking mindset that not only drives the sale of many products, but the creation and marketing of the products themselves. It may be helpful to claim that some sort of placebo is the driving agent in the initial effect of some item purchased, but that would be a condescending misunderstanding of what that mechanism truly is: Placebo Effect:
(1) Term used to refer to the process by which the belief of a target may cause results (physical or psychic) to occur with no known effort being made by the supposed agent. (2) The most powerful, cheapest, and therefore least researched method of healing.*
People advance at different rates, so some will react to purchase from a fear-oriented mindset, while others will buy as an expression of abundance, and see price as a [rightful] expression of appreciation for service or product received.
It is amazing what a change of mind[set] can accomplish. Wouldn't you agree?
So called 'scientific' experiments, you can argue, are not always objective either. The way you design the experiment often influences the outcome, and as you probably saw in What the Bleep, the result of the experiment can be influenced by the expectation of the observer. If it cannot be proven mathematically, then there is a possibility that the fault lies in the manmade system of mathematics, and not the new theory.
Which makes me wonder if there can really ever be such a thing as complete objectivity. All this subjectivity can be a little frustrating at times.
If you're gonna put it that way David, then you have to ask if there is some place that you can use items in a completely objective way. Won't you always be using something in a contextual environment? Won't people always be forming opinions about what you do, how you do it, why you do it, and what tools you use to do whatever it is with, especially if you do it well (well enough to produce envy/admiration)?
Like you build a deck to the back of your house. Man! That looks good! Where did you get the wood? You stained it? What kind of stain did you use? Hand applied? No? You used a power-mister? Really? What brand? etc.
It is like that with a lot of things. So many things, that people form opinions, and so many opinions that there are whole websites where people just post about things they've used and formed an opinion about. Not scientific of course. Usually certain items get many good reviews, yet will often have one or two bad reviews. This means a dud slipped through. It's good to know just in case you still want to play the odds that you'll get a good item. If you see a mixed bag, then it's 50/50 City. If you see mainly bad reviews then Only If You're Feeling Lucky. As I said, not scientific, but the marketplace has its on language.
We don't have that luxury here. These are specialty items. There are often no reviews at all. No testimonials on the website. Nothing but the product for sale. it would be nice if someone who has bought the item told us about it. Why did they buy it? How was it used? What were the results? Would you buy from Store X again?
If you used the product and it didn't work, what were the circumstances? Tell us as much as you can about that too.
What we are not interested in is opinions about why you think something should or should not work. You have nothing to base your opinion on. Even if your [biased] opinion is about another (biased) product, you have no experience to share, good, bad or indifferent. I have posted here about products that I bought, that didn't meet expectation, not even close as a matter of fact. I don't feel particularly bad. It was a learning experience. Because of it, I can help someone else that maybe what I learned can be of use to them. Maybe my context in using the device or product was wrong. If I post about it, I'll probably find out. That's all any of us can do.
In a way, I guess an experiment is like a testimonial with more restrictions and details, so people can try to reproduce the same effect by recreating the same circumstances.
So the results of an experiment are in fact, the testimonial of the experimenters. (Though I guess the fact that you can recreate the circumstances due to the controlled nature of experiments would make it seem like a more reliable type of testimonial?)
Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 3:06 pm Post subject: Power of testimonials
Well, I think you're right david, if you mean that researchers will (have to) report their findings and there'll always be the risk of bias in a direction prematurely confirming their pet hypothesis (or hypotheses). So, a proper research procedure definitely requires the inclusion of a panel of independent experts able and prepared to thoroughly check and recheck the original findings. This will, of course be much easier and less time-consuming if you’ve got a standardized set of data. That’s why “ordinary” testimonials (such as displayed in commercial web sites) do not qualify as appropriate research material. One customer will probably be very elaborate in his/her response while another may deliver a very short and superficial “report”, rendering a sensible comparison practically impossible. So you’ll quite necessarily have to avail yourself of questionnaires, checklists and the likes in order to find clear, straightforward answers to your research questions. Agreed??
Now, I’m sure one day some professor from Duke University, London University College or Kuala Lumpur University even, will take up the courageous initiative to instigate a proper research project featuring radionic as well as energetic instruments. Just you wait; that’ll be the day, don’t you think? And, oh yes, courageous, because as you can see from Mr GreenTea's analysis such an endeavour may prove to be incredibly complicated, contrary to many a layman's ideas. _________________ Virtual magic, total power
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And, oh yes, courageous, because as you can see from Mr GreenTea's analysis such an endeavour may prove to be incredibly complicated, contrary to many a layman's ideas. 
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